TOPIC: ASP Update: KS 2/3 Complete. IGG starts this month

While I completely applaud Brax's response above, from what I've seen I think that most of the anxiety seems to stem from the unknown. The bulk of the criticism that I have seen floating around here, the ASP funding page comments, and social media points to the untimely manner of updates regarding fulfillment dates.

I understand that the SaberForge team has a lot on their plate right now, and the idea of demanding Phil to stop everything he's doing to give a minute by minute update the moment things change whether for the better or the worse is unreasonable.

I have no doubt that all of our ASP pre-orders will arrive at some point. I consider myself to be an exceedingly patient individual, but even I find myself scouring at least four different websites almost daily to see if there is any news of my fellow IGG backers starting to receive their sabers. And that's only because I'm just so excited to receive mine It's also why I created that infamous IGG backer spreadsheet

That being said, I think that much of the anxiety could be defused if, for example, at least a regular weekly update on pre-order shipping status was posted. They say that "no news is good news" but I personally would rather have any news than no news. Even if it's just a sentence or two saying "Sorry, guys. Running a bit behind schedule from the last update. Here's where we are now." Something as brief as that also has the potential to cut down on the number of emails that Melissa may be receiving asking for an update on the timeline. Just my thoughts.

Patiently and eagerly awaiting my IGG ASP saber

I applaud all of backers that are patient so far. I never expected so many people to back the project. When SF saw all the orders they probably cheered and panicked at the same time. There have been delays but that was to be expected. I am happy seeing more and more people getting their sabers. Excited to see what others created.

Well, I just got the email I did not expect at this time, but here it is:
Hello. I'm very sorry, however I am not able to provide a rough estimate for your order. We are hoping to have all Kickstarter and Indiegogo orders shipped out within the next 2-3 months, however, there are many variables that could cause a potential delay. If you need to change your shipping address, we can take care of that for you. If you do not receive an email notifying you that your order is nearing completion by the time you have to move, just message us here and we will adjust your shipping address for you.
May the Forge be with you!
Melissa

I guess we can all see that ASP is not going out in May anymore. Well, all we can do is keep waiting for our sabers to get here. Good luck everybody that is waiting.

Glad to see they sent you an email, I was actually wondering about that myself as I am moving from Dallas to Houston at the end of June. Currently I'm 495/496 on IGG but I figure they won't be able to get to mine for another couple of months. It's not a big deal tbh, I also just want to make sure I'll be able to update my change of address before they ship and not gift $1400 of sabers to the people that buy my house .

I'd also like to echo gcnywaldork comments, I think it would be beneficial to post updates about where the production process is every couple of weeks. I get that it might be seen as a waste of time but think of it as a forward investment on the time mods have to spend dealing with posts from upset customers, and naysayers demanding explanations. It cuts a lot of those headaches off at the pass, and makes it easier for the community itself to help police its own with passing legit information.

Take it from our point of view. The last real info we got was that SF was pumping out ~300 orders a week, KS was in the finishing stages and IGG was going to start soon, and that the plan was to have pre-orders shipped by the end of the month. That was 3 weeks ago. Like many here I've been checking emails on a daily basis as well as Facebook, these forums and other sources to try to determine if my order was any closer in the pipeline . We are all just that excited. It's a business, we understand that, but this is a business based on building glowing, whooshing, crackling toy sticks for a clientele comprised of primarily adults with childhood fantasies. Understanding how to talk to us is just another part of the battle.

2-3 more months? *Sigh* Well, I guess that's more time to save parts.

That may be a stock reply from previous months they haven't updated yet. I would take it with a grain of salt.

Heh, fair point. Well, at this rate I think it's best to just accept that my hilt will come as a happy surprise.

We all know this has become a heated topic. I know they are actively working on it. They understand we are rightfully disappointed with the time frame (I don't think anyone can honestly argue that completing a product over 5 months past the expected completion time is appropriate. Entire Wal-Marts are built in less time).

But I believe SF continues to work hard on filling the agreement. At least I choose to believe that. Patience is the only realistic option at this time. The additional frustration does not make the project finish any faster. When I heard all KS/IGG products were to be finished by today the math didn't add up and I was hoping SF would prove me wrong.

If they deliver the high quality and tested/dependable product they claim, I will consider it worth the wait. With many things in life there are 3 factors: time, money, and quality. You can usually choose any 2 at the cost of the 3rd. We entered this knowing it was a new product line and time was going to play a factor. But if they can provide a high quality product for a reasonable price for the quality, then it is still a 'win' long term.

Unfortunately there have been a wide range of mixed reviews on satisfaction and parts not working. This is probably my greater concern if these are legitimate issues. These may be unrealistic claims, or issues with training new staff, or the time pressure they are now under. Regardless of the reason, I would rather wait a little longer to have it done right.

I am a KS supporter and still have not heard about a completion date as of April 30th. I hope my fellow KS/IGG supporters can hang in there with me. I am a bit disappointed that so many supporters, including myself, missed out on having their sabers for SW episode 7 and now Star Wars Day. I will post immediately when I hear something else.

Dang it. Now I've found the body I ordered is one that won't match the builder, and in turn, won't match my hilt. I hope I can't get rid of the black finish without too much trouble.

I too am a IGG backer and while the wait is longer than expected, I'm still optimistic that any delay is due to the unexpected turnout as well as the needs to keep the normal aspects of Saberforge operational. Keep in mind that due to the unexpected response to the ASP project a new assembly line had to built, pass inspection and staffed with new workers.Oh, and Phil welcomed his first child into the world during this time, trust me, that takes some adjustment. All of this takes time and while the unrealistic delivery date causes disappointment, anger and mistrust, whenever you get those feelings just think back to those feelings of excitement when you received that joyous news. It sounds cheesy, but it works. In the meantime you can do what I did and order an inferior product from the competition and work on your spins and flourishes with a saber you won't mind dropping a few dozen times. All in all we are in essence waiting on toys.....highly expensive and awesome toys, but toys none the less. I say patience young padawan and may the Force be with you.

You are correct Brax, and I do not dispute anything they are trying to do or what they are doing. I am simply going off what Phil said in his kickstart video. Where he said they have a machine shop standing buy to produce the product. This will lower cost and lead time. @3:02 of video.

So I am not upset that it is talking long. I am more concern with the promises that were made to get our money, and the lack of hearing from Phil himself on this issue. Cause it is sounding to me from everything I am reading and hearing, they had to build a new shop and expand. So where was this machine shop they partner with? Why when stated the money will get the parts built to cut lead time that it is taking so long now, when they got 4x the amount they needed to work with this machine shop to produce the items?

Like I said, not questioning they are trying, am questioning what was told to us to begin with and the lack of response from Phil. I still have faith and waiting for my goods. But once they get caught up, are we still looking at this lead time?

Perhaps in the beginning, they needed a partnership with another shop, and then decided instead to expand their own facilities. I don't know for a fact that is how it went down, but the pictures below of their new expanded shop would indicate that, whatever the reason, it has become a reality.

I always love seeing those production pictures. Really puts into perspective as to what goes into the creation of our sabers. It makes me appreciate it that much more.

They use a manufacturer in China for the raw components and do the finishing work (sanding, painting, installing, etc.) here in the USA.

First off, having X amount of money over a goal doesn't mean that the process of building parts moves that much faster. Having that many orders above their expectations slowed them down by three to four months.

Imagine your business is scaled to make 20 products (P) a week. Suddenly you have an order for 10,000P and you don't have the necessary manpower or factory space to increase your weekly production of 20P. Then there's a movie released that makes people very interested in P which increases the weekly orders of P from 20P to 100P. You now have a demand of 100P a week plus the 10,000P single order.

You then make plans to expand your manufacturing space plus hire and train 30+ new employees to make P. The ordering/building of the new manufacturing space takes several months and getting OSHA to sign off on it takes another month or so on top of that. Now that you have your manufacturing space you can hire and train new employees some who, inevitably, will wash out in the first few weeks and you'll have to start the hiring process again which will slow down production. While you've been building the manufacturing space your 100P orders a week have been racking up so much that you've closed one of your online shop fronts on etsy to slow down the number of orders coming in and you're now getting an additional 70P instead of 100P ordered a week.

So. You're now ready to start working on that 10,000P order but you have an enormous backlog of P orders from months of increased interest. So you get to work on both simultaneously on both sets of P orders. You're now almost five months behind schedule and while you may have received alotta money you didn't have the capital available months earlier to have all the manufacturing space and new hires prepped to be ready to go once your overseas supplier, who wanted the money upfront, ships you the raw parts. You now are running several weeks behind your projected lead times with your regular P orders and several months behind on the 10,000P order. Your hopes for reducing lead times across the board are dashed for the time being until such a time that you've managed to catch up.

Fair enough H2, Like said not doubting not upset. Just a person with questions on what was said and being done. And wondering the plans. Regardless of what is going on will be a faithful customer.

Sorry if that came off as harsh or ranty, that wasn't my intent. I've had the benefit of watching this whole process from start to finish so I'm intimately familiar with most of the ins and outs of what's been going on. I understand that these long waits are very tough for everyone involved and expectations could have been managed better. I should be more patient when questions are asked.

are they getting their aluminum stock from china or does come with a general shape?

That's why I believe kickstarter should have a firm ceiling and not just a floor. Scaling issues are a problem with just about every popular kickstarter and they all end up having delays or just fail. But even with that the lack of communication is by far the most frustrating. We are forced to piece together information from different people's email or do math to try and estimate when our saber is coming. Never had to do this with other companies. And its not just asp, it was a problem with the other saber I ordered through here. Even if nothing has changed let us know that. No news is news so at least we know what is going on. Communication by far has been the biggest complaint but saber forge doesn't seem to get it. They're not taking the feedback to heart and still won't send out regular updates

From what I understand they get cast parts that need to be polished/painted/etc.

h2soy, it wasn't harsh at all. But thank you for the reply.